Why outrage over nudity but silence over murders?
Talking Points host Elvin Grant has challenged residents to show the same — or greater — outrage over violent crime as they have shown over nudity, vulgarity and inappropriate behaviour at public events.
Grant made the argument amid renewed debate over standards of dress and behaviour at the recently concluded Emancipation Festival, where some costumes and displays sparked criticism about what should be acceptable at publicly funded cultural celebrations.
“A lot of morality is being preached about festival and the costumes and the attire, and quite rightly so in a lot of instances. We have to be careful that we don’t become a society of selective outrage,” Grant said.
However, Grant questioned why recent violent incidents, including a shooting in Carrot Bay and a stabbing in Road Town during Rise and Shine, have not generated the same sustained public debate.
“Why isn’t there a similar sort of outrage about crime in the territory? Why are people being shot down in broad daylight? Why are people being gunned down like dogs in the street?” he asked. “We’ve got to have the same or more outrage for the loss of human life.”
Grant also bemoaned the troubling pattern of unsolved crimes, including the killing of young Trinity Moses, saying many families have been waiting years for answers.
“We need to understand why there’s such a breakdown of law and order in society that persons believe they can take armed weapons into an emancipation celebration, into a nightclub, into a bar and just gun someone down without repercussion,” Grant said.
Co-host Damion Grange agreed with Grant’s position, and suggested the problem is connected to a broader deterioration of family and community structures.
He argued that rising living costs are also placing additional pressure on families, forcing more adults and seniors into the workforce and reducing the supervision and guidance once available to young people.
“I’m just saying, it’s a multi-pronged problem,” Grange said.
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Have we become so dense as a people that we dont know why there is more outrage expressed for nudity than violent crime? Like who the hell is out here promoting violent crime publicly? You would think its obvious enough that people dont need convincing. On the other hand nudity is being pushed as something liberating, fun and a form of “expression” on how times are “changing”. Those are the people that are lost, those are the people who need the loudest voice right now. Both are bad but one is blatantly obvious
Not reporting on murders, or not making a public outcry following murders, signals that murders are NORMAL or commonplace. Do you really want to live in a society where murders are just brushed under a rug??? It’s not promoting murder, its making an example of it so that we can do better.
Girls wearing little clothing during a festival isn’t hurting anyone. Murder is literally killing people, by definition. Wake up.
Please change this photo. These big a** women here exposing themselves on the streets of the capital is just sooo disgusting!!! They think they look good. Just being deceived. Pure vanity
The problem is the lewd, not the nude.
Under the guise of decency we overly sexualise the female body by tantalisingly drawing attention to the breasts and pudendum. Missionary zeal created the problem and social media perpetuate it.
In terms of selective outrage, social media again has a lot to answer for. As an artist, I’m permitted to post images that depict violence, but not images that depict the God given beauty of the human form.
No one is going to gun you down for snitching out a nude person that’s why.
reproducing is the opposite of killing.
People who dislike this comment don’t understand how deep it is. If you stay silent about murders and discourage behavior that lead to reproduction that leads to a decline of the population. Let young people do what they do best. Yall had your time
Brother Elvin for at large candidate.
Dead bodies are not good sites!!
Sadly, we have already become a society of selective outrage, a candlelight vigil and hashtag movement society, where public emotion often appears strongest after the fact rather than in demanding meaningful action beforehand.
But while concerns about public decency are valid, nudity and murder are not comparable. One may offend cultural sensibilities; the other destroys lives, leaves families grieving, and threatens public safety.
If there is to be outrage, violent crime should command far more attention than festival attire. We can care about both, but human life must always come first.
I read the article, and I believe the outrage over nudity and the outrage over murders are both warranted. They are not mutually exclusive issues.
The bigger conversation we need to have is about the culture we are increasingly normalizing and the influence that culture can have on young people.
We have normalized a culture that increasingly glorifies criminality, disrespect for authority, anti-police attitudes, disorder, excessive partying and drinking, drugs, promiscuity, vulgarity, gangs, violence and the idea of living a “fast life.”
Listen to some of the music being played at these events. A significant amount of it contains lyrics glorifying sex, drugs, guns, gangs, violence and criminal lifestyles. Then look at some of the behavior taking place at the events themselves.
Festival just passed. How many fights did we witness?
At J’ouvert, how many young people were photographed throwing up gang and gun signs? How many were wearing ski masks or similar face coverings that resemble the type of masks criminals use to conceal their identities?
And somehow, much of this behavior has become so normalized that anyone who questions it can be treated as though they are the problem.
That is precisely the problem.
I am not saying that every person who attends Festival or J’ouvert is a criminal. Obviously, that would be ridiculous. Nor am I saying that nudity alone causes crime. My argument is that we need to be honest about the broader environment we are creating and the messages we are sending to young people.
Young people are impressionable. When they repeatedly see violence, gangs, drugs, hypersexualized behavior, disrespect and reckless behavior celebrated through music, social media and major public events, some will inevitably absorb those messages. Even young people who know better can eventually feel pressure to imitate what everyone around them is doing.
Eventually, behavior that should concern us begins to feel normal, while responsible behavior is portrayed as boring, judgmental or “weird.”
Then something serious happens.
A murder.
A shooting.
A gun seizure.
A drug seizure.
A violent incident.
Suddenly, everyone is calling for peace.
But we cannot have it both ways.
We cannot spend months and years complaining about gangs, guns, violence and criminality while simultaneously refusing to examine the culture and environments that can help normalize those behaviors among young people.
And there is another uncomfortable conversation we need to have.
People in our communities often know who the troublesome individuals are. They know who associates with criminals. They know who is carrying guns. They know who suddenly has unexplained wealth, expensive jewelry, fast boats or other assets that don’t appear consistent with any legitimate source of income.
Yet when violence occurs, everyone suddenly acts surprised.
I have personally seen the same types of people who complain about violence socializing and partying alongside individuals who are widely known within the community to be involved in criminal activity.
If we genuinely want peace, we cannot only demand it after someone is murdered. We also have to be willing to distance ourselves from the people and behaviors that contribute to the environment in which violence thrives.
And this is why I don’t understand the selective outrage.
People will circulate and criticize photographs showing vulgar or sexually explicit behavior and the young adults would lash back defending it, but they are also defending the young people who are photographed throwing up gun and gang signs at these very same vulgar events…..
Where is the outrage when young people are wearing masks that resemble those used by criminals at these events?
Where is the outrage when someone fires a gun into a crowd at jouvert that yall love so much?
Where is the outrage when music at these events repeatedly glorifies guns, gangs, drugs and violence?
The photograph of someone behaving vulgarly isn’t the entire problem. Neither is one song, one dance, or one event.
The issue is the cumulative culture.
It is the combination of the music, the imagery, the behavior, the normalization of violence, the glorification of criminal lifestyles, the influence of social media, and the willingness of society to dismiss concerns because “that’s just how young people behave.”
No. We should not automatically accept that.
If we genuinely care about young people, we should be willing to tell them when something is wrong—even when telling them the truth is unpopular.
Being loud doesn’t make an argument correct. Being popular doesn’t make something positive. And something being culturally accepted doesn’t automatically make it healthy for our community.
This is also why I believe the outrage over nudity and the outrage over murders should coexist.
We can condemn murder while also questioning the culture surrounding these events.
We can condemn sexual exploitation and inappropriate exposure of minors while also condemning gangs and gun violence.
We can demand accountability from criminals while also demanding accountability from ourselves as a community.
One does not cancel out the other.
If we truly want to reduce crime, we have to be willing to examine everything that contributes to the environment in which crime and violence become normalized.
And that includes the culture we promote, the music we celebrate, the behavior we excuse, the people we continue to associate with, and the examples we set for our children.
These same vulgar events are filled with low self esteem women and minors who would lay down with criminals or men who partake in these events and expect that person to be a responsible adult only to end up single parent raising a broken home and creating more problematic youths and criminals. creating more females that love “gun man/badman” creating more males without fathers or with criminals father where they become criminals too. plenty baby showers with no ring then 4-7 years later them split up.
We cannot demand peace while continuously celebrating or normalizing the very behaviors that undermine it.
At some point, we have to be honest enough to ask ourselves:
**What exactly are we teaching the next generation to admire?**
You believe the behavior at these events promotes crime and violence, but it doesn’t. We all know that the murders in this country are largely drug-related—they have nothing to do with sexuality. It’s unfair to equate murder with liberal-leaning behavior or slander them with the same severity. Taking a life is far more damaging and should be treated as the distinct, serious crime that it is.
ohh yess cause we the people are telling the male yutes to go kill themselves and asking for the young ladies to dress more modestly…gun violence can be address at home and watching the company the kids have (parenting) but how you going tell a young lady not to expose herself sexualy if that’s what she sees everyday all day
we should be outraged over both, both of them are bringin gdown the bvi
That comment just shows ignorance on the part of the person who said it. Isn’t there now and always been outrage over violence and crime in the BVI? Whoever believes the nudity is getting more response is someone who agrees with it and is defending it. Speaking out against one thing does not mean the other is not an issue. Grow up please!
That’s some nice APPLES
Typicallly, naked people are just happy to be here… Murdered people, not so much.
i glad fraser made that comment about festival and these vulgar events
Let the Party Animals Defend Themselves
I’m actually glad Fraser said this.
Let the “party animals” defend themselves.
For weeks, we’ve heard people complain about the cost of living, rising prices and how difficult things are financially. Yet many of the same people had no problem spending money on festival—buying tickets, drinks, food, outfits and everything else that comes with partying.
I remember someone calling me “broke” simply because I said I don’t agree with what festival promotes to our society and, particularly, to easily influenced young people: sexualized behavior, minors being underdressed, gang culture, violence, promiscuity, drunkenness, fighting and the glorification of the fast life.
So if I’m “broke” because I chose not to spend my money participating in that, then don’t turn around and complain about the cost of living while proudly showing everyone how much money you had to spend partying.
Remember the conversations people were having about how many festival tickets were sold and how many people attended different nights—especially the excitement surrounding major artists and which night had the biggest crowd. People were more than happy to talk about attendance numbers and spending when it came to entertainment.
So why is it suddenly offensive when a politician points out the contradiction?
Now, to be fair, Fraser cannot use festival attendance to judge the financial situation of an entire population. A relatively small percentage of the population attending festival does not mean everyone in the territory is financially comfortable. Plenty of responsible people—including myself—simply chose not to attend. I saved my money, met my financial obligations and stayed within my priorities.
But there is also a reality that some people prioritize partying so heavily that they will spend their last dollar doing it, even when they have other financial responsibilities. That is a legitimate issue worth discussing.
And let’s not pretend festival is the only way people can relax and unwind. We live in paradise. We have beaches, hiking, spas, restaurants, bars, boating and countless other ways to enjoy ourselves without participating in an environment that repeatedly becomes associated with excessive drinking, fights, vulgar behavior and other disorder.
What bothered me even more was what happened during the festival period.
We complain about gangs, guns, drugs and violence, yet when violence occurs around these events, including murders and reports of firearms being discharged into crowds, we still carry on as if nothing happened. Instead of collectively saying, “Enough is enough,” and demonstrating that violence has consequences for our community, the partying continues.
That says something about our priorities.
And now we’re seeing warnings about electricity increases and rising operating costs for businesses, which will eventually filter down to consumers. Those prices are unlikely to simply disappear.
So let’s see what happens when the next big party comes around—New Year’s, Lobster Festival, next year’s festival, and whatever else is on the calendar.
If people are genuinely serious about the cost of living, then there are peaceful ways to demonstrate that. Reduce unnecessary spending. Stop supporting events and businesses you believe are contributing to the problem. Organize peaceful marches. Put pressure on policymakers. Make your concerns impossible to ignore.
But you cannot spend heavily on entertainment, proudly advertise how much you enjoyed the biggest parties, and then become offended when someone points out that your spending choices appear inconsistent with your complaints about the cost of living.
And yes, I understand that not everyone who attends festival behaves badly. There are people who simply want music, entertainment and a good time. That’s their choice.
But we also need to be honest about the culture that increasingly surrounds these events—the drinking, fights, sexualized dancing, smoking, disrespect, gang symbolism, children imitating violent behavior and the normalization of things that we simultaneously complain are destroying our society.
We cannot constantly condemn the consequences while enthusiastically supporting everything that helps normalize the culture behind them.
So yes, Fraser caught some young people with that comment.
Take the blow.
If you believe your priorities are different, demonstrate it through your actions—not just your Facebook posts about how expensive everything has become.
**Priorities are revealed by where we choose to put our money.**
so now you want our daughters of the soil to travel to another country to partake in the same festivities where they can dress and party like the rest of them without criticism? what about us that want to see home grown batty?
We shouldn’t have a Jamaican talk show host telling us about Jamaican carnival and only Jamaican culture is showcased. He’s always defending and comparing Jamaica to Tortola as if Jamaica don’t have slacknesse during their carnival like it’s all cultural. Outsiders should not be on a talk show speaking about the VI we can’t go there and do it.
The troubling issue of concern is ,why are there sooomany Jamaicans given permission to enter and reside in these VI. The worse of the Northern hemisphere in every aspect they infest the Lil lil Vi with degradation and diseases and varied crimes,murders their specialty.To the extent that Jamaican policemen are imported and paid our hard earned tax dollars to keep some behind our prison bars and monitor the loose oness. They give zero ,empty vessels of humanity sucking the life of everything everywhere. They have nothing to give but dark clouds and ruin. A Lilil place like this.
Jamaicans in excess is a bad sign and a big lookout any and everywhere place like this…pick from the cream at the top and leave places like Jamaica,St Vincent and other horrors away out in their environment of badness non stop.The BVI have choice for chrissake!!! We are better than this muck up of overloaded prison and public porno by these empty handed children of former slaves.
The really sad part about all this mess in the culture is that taxpayers money paying for it. The cream outrage should be why government supporting, sponsoring and encouraging the amount of slackness In the BVI? That picture is from the Uber soca cruise party that had our whole country shut down for half a day, at our expense. Ridiculous, senseless wasteful Premier giving license to this degrading, wutlissniss. The Vybes Cartel show he paid for will leave a bitter taste here for a long long time.
Garrot scums are simply Garrot scums anywhere everywhere and always.
The mental frig up is that the BVI import these harlOTs thieves and murderers,give them passport status then feign complaint about their natural indigenous behaviours.
A pox on these VI for importing these slimy critters en mass….simply to distract attention from the BVI massive involvement in the drug passage via the BVI.
Time longer than twine,tis tru tru
@ Jingle Belks.. Do you know the meaning of garotte?
Yes,I – We know what it (garrote) means colloquially,vernacularly,Patois and also formally.
I also know that Probasco is an altered form of Probacki ,shaped by Portuguese influence.
** Plenty ting me ah know,an wha me nah no me look fo larn. Yes Sah!!